HomeMy WebLinkAbouttecm_100912TRAFFIC ENGINEERING COMMITTEE MINUTES
UKIAH CIVIC CENTER
4 Conference Room No. 3
5 300 Seminary Avenue
6 Ukiah, California 95482
8 TUESDAY, October 9, 2012
9 3:00 P.M.
10
11 Members Present Others Present
12 Steve Turner, Chair
13 Dan Baxter, MTA, Vice -Chair
14 Ben Kageyama, Staff
15 John Lampi, Public Representative
16 Trent Taylor, UPD
17 Kim Jordan, Staff
18 Jerry Whitaker, Staff
19 Rick Seanor, Staff
20 Members Absent Staff Present
21 Tm Eriksen, Staff Cathy Elawadly, Recording Secretary
22
23 1. CALL TO ORDER
24 Chair Turner called the Traffic Engineering Committee meeting to order at 3:06 p.m.
2ti
2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES -February 14, 2012
27 Member Jordan made the following corrections:
28
29 Page 2, item 5a, 2nd bullet to read, 'Bollards could be used to provide more safety to the affected corner
30 probably can't be put on private property due to planning requirements.'
31
32 Page 2, item 5b, 3`d bullet to read, 'The other 24- minute zones see more use than these particular ones.'
33
34 Page 2, Motion: Baxter/Whitaker, sentence following should read, 'Discussion ensued in regards to the
35 location on N. Oak Street between Standiey and Smith Streets.'
36
37 MIS Jordan /Baxter to approve the minutes of February 14, 2012, as amended. Motion carried by an all
38 AYE voice vote.
39
40 3. AUDIENCE COMMENTS ON NON - AGENDA ITEMS
41 Antonio Andrade:
42 • There have been a number of arrow signs inserted on the Bush Street end of Oak Street relative to the new
43 walking trails for the City of'Ukiah.
44 . While he is supportive of these directional walking signs pointed out there is one sign at the end of the
45 pathway along Orr Creek that directs pedestrians across the street to a further path that goes along
46 Pomolita Middle School that has no crosswalk in this location. Questions whether or not it is appropriate for
47 the City to be installing these arrow signs that essentially encourages people to jaywalk. This is likely a
48 safety concern.
49
50 Member Jordan:
51 . This may have been a Paths, Open Space and Creeks Commission (POSCC) project.
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I Member Whitaker: The City Street Department was instructed to place the arrow signs where directed.
2
Member Seanor: The project was orchestrated by the Ukiah Valley Trail Group and /or in combination with
another citizen's group through grant funding.
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6 Chair Turner: Jaywalking is legal term and does not apply to that particular street in question. While he
7 understands Mr. Andrade's point, the aspect of jaywalking can only occur between two signalized intersections.
8
9 4. OLD BUSINESS
10
11 5. NEW BUSINESS
12 5a. Discussion and Possible Action Regarding Traffic Concerns in the Vicinity of North Oak Street,
13 Cypress Avenue, and North Pine Street
14
15 Member Taylor:
16 • Has reviewed the traffic concerns with some of the neighborhood and through the use of the radar
17 trailer provided some mitigation measures in this regard. The speed radar trailer is an effective tool to
18 provide direct feedback to drivers of their speed compared to the posted speed zone.
19 • A traffic survey has been completed on North Oak Street and this allows for the use of radar in this
20 area, as well as enforcement thereof.
21 • The focus has been with the traffic issues on North Oak Street, but more recently the focus has been
22 with traffic concerns on Cypress Avenue and North Pine Street.
23
24 Member Seanor:
25 • Referred to his memorandum dated October 4, 2012 regarding this agenda item and gave a staff report
26 concerning traffic issues on North Oak Street and neighborhood complaints about speeding, reckless
27 driving, and also signage on Cypress Avenue and North Pine Street.
28 • North Oak Street is designated as a collector street and serves as an alternate route to connect Low
2' ) Gap Road with the Downtown and is intended to carry more traffic than a local residential street.
3 • In May 2012, a speed survey completed on North Oak Street confirmed the posted 25 mph speed zone
31 is consistent with the speed limited posted.
32 • Explained how speed zones for areas are set based on the 85th percentile speed of the surveyed traffic.
33 In this case, drivers were traveling 25 mph so there is no justification for a change to the speed limit.
34 • Cypress Avenue and Pine Street are classified as local streets in the neighborhood that provide access
35 to neighborhoods, as well as a route to Pomolita Middle School.
36 • North Pine Street is fairly wide and has a valley gutter for street drainage purposes at its intersection at
37 Cypress Avenue.
38 • There is also an offset jog of Cypress Avenue at its intersection with North Pine Street as shown in
39 Attachment `B' of the memorandum.
40 • Staff researched the accident records for North Pine Street and Cypress Avenue intersection and
41 determined in the last nine years there have been only two reported accidents at the intersection
42 related to driving under the influence.
43 • With regard to review of signage applications for the intersection of North Pine Street and Cypress
44 Avenue, staff determined a DIP sign with a 10 mph advisory speed plate and a Turn sign with a 10 mph
45 advisory speed plate would be appropriate for this location. Attachment'C' provides examples of a DIP
46 Sign, Advisory Speed Plate that would be 10 mph and Turn Sign.
47 • Requests the committee discuss the traffic concerns and consider his recommendation as provided for
48 in his memorandum.
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50 Chair Turner recommended the discussion begin with North Oak Street followed by Pine Street and Cypress
51 Avenue.
52
53 North Oak Street
54 Julie Price:
5' Would like to know more about the location of the speed zone study conducted on North Oak Street.
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1 Resides on that section of North Oak Street at Henry Street and Scott Street.
2 When heading north just past the former U S Post Office the street drops down such that people speed
coming down the hill.
4 Would guess that people are traveling faster than 25 mph in this section.
5
6 Member Seanor: Hilly areas are typically avoided when conducting a speed survey because it is not a true
7 representation of the natural flow of traffic.
8
9 Member Taylor: The traffic survey included the street segment from Scott Street to Low Gap Road.
10
11 Member Seanor: N. Oak Street from Henry to Scott Street is classified as a collector street.
12
13 James Connerton:
14 • Resides to the south of Orr Creek on North Oak Street right where the incline comes down from where
15 Gibson Street ends.
16 • It is interesting that of the 85% of the cars surveyed in the study were actually traveling 25 mph. Has
17 observed in this area that while most people traveling in the range of 25 mph, people tend to drive faster
18 than 25 mph down the incline.
19 . Likes that there speed awareness mechanisms used on streets to remind people of their speed.
20 • While he estimates that approximately 5% of the drivers speed, it is enough to voice a concern.
21 . Is of the opinion the only way to likely change the habits of speeding and /or reckless drivers is to implement
22 some type of a deterrent.
23 • Signage is visible heading southerly on the hill of N. Oak Street and is noticed by drivers. However, coming
24 from the Downtown area has only seen one 25 mph sign and this sign is not clearly visible to motorists.
25 The sign is located on N. Oak Street before Scott Street.
26
27 Antonio Andrade:
28 • Understands the speed survey is not done by a speed caddy.
• Likes the speed caddy because it reminds people of their speed and provides a warning.
30 • Frequently walks on both Bush Street and Oak Street and observes people traveling much faster than 25
31 mph on these streets.
32
33 Member Seanor: Explained speed surveys are done with a radar gun. The gun must be certified are checked and
34 calibrated to make certain they are working correctly. The person conducting the survey sits in a car that is
35 essentially undetectable and surveys a 100 cars during regular daylight hours, not necessarily during peak times
36 but rather during times when traffic flows normally. In addition to the speed survey, the traffic study takes into
37 consideration number of accidents on the street and other factors on the street. When complete, a registered traffic
38 engineer certifies the study.
39
40 Jeff Trouette:
41 . Requests that TEC meetings be held after regular business hours so more people would have the
42 opportunity to attend.
43 • Speed surveys require hard data that should take into consider street widths and other factors.
44 . Supports the City Police Department do some traffic surveying on their own by taking a period of time, write
45 some tickets and see if there is a problem. If there is a traffic issue, then there is concrete information with
46 which to inform the residents.
47 • Has observed as a mitigation measure and /or traffic deterrent the effectiveness of solar powered signs
48 similar to those of the radar trailer.
49 • The purchase of solar powered signs for neighborhoods that have traffic issues is not really necessary
50 when TEC meetings offer the opportunity to discuss what type of mitigation measures would be
51 appropriate.
52 . Recommends the Police Department observe traffic on City streets, particularly during peak times as a
53 possible mitigation measure /deterrent.
54
5 ) Member Baxter:
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1 . If a speed study finds the speed should be higher, the speed limit must be changed to reflect this find.
2__ \ • Allowing for an automated sign does remind people to look at their speed and slow down.
4 ) Daphine MacNeil:
5 . Resides on N. Oak Street and has observed that someone in the early morning hours regularly drives very
6 fast. It is likely this individual would not pay any attention to an automatic speed sign.
7 . Suggests the construction of a small roundabout right at the intersection of Cypress Avenue and N. Oak
8 Street. Roundabouts have been done successfully constructed in neighborhoods with narrow streets and
9 cited some examples in other cities. It is likely the City Fire and Police Departments would oppose this
10 approach looking at the history of the roundabout on Clara Avenue.
11 • It is remarkable how few accidents there are given the traffic volume and recklessness that occurs on N.
12 Oak Street.
13
14 There was discussion concerning the approximate costs of the automated radar machines.
15
16 Emily Turula:
17 . It may be that increasing the signage on N. Oak Street by posting some 25 mph signs would alter the
18 behavior of drivers. People might be thinking N. Oak Street is a 30 mph speed zone.
19 • Suggests putting signage on the hilly areas of N. Oak Street.
20
21 Member Whitaker:
22 . Noted the speed limit in residential areas is 25 mph regardless.
23 • More signs mean more maintenance on the part of City Street crews,
24
25 James Connerton:
26 • People should know the speed limit in residential areas is 25 mph.
27 . Is of the opinion a visual speed caddy functions as a speed reminder and the more visible the better.
2R • Concurs that speed studies should be conducted not so much during regular hours but rather during peak
2' ) hours because people tend to speed when they are in a hurry, such as late for work or an appointment.
30 • Providing for a visual speed caddy as signage and /or other type of deterrent in a place where it is easy to
31 speed would remind people about speeding.
32
33 Cypress Avenue and North Pine Street
34
35 Antonio Andrade:
36 • Just north of the dip one will see all sorts of scrapes and transmission oil from cars that hit the dip going too
37 fast for the road condition.
38 • Has observed on Pine Street children play ball on Pine Street. There are trees that would obscure a stop
39 sign.
40 • Has witnessed that people are 'shocked' after hitting the dip in the street because they are not aware it
41 exists.
42 . One way to solve the problem of the dip in the road is for the City to put in a storm drain system from Bush
43 Street to Oak Street.
44
45 It was noted 'Stop' would be painted on the street advising of a stop sign.
46
47 Member Whitaker:
48 • Would like to see a stop sign at Pine Street and Cypress Avenue. In this way, people will have to stop and
49 go through the dip slowly.
50 • Is of the opinion providing for a DIP sign and an arrow sign at Mr. Trouette's driveway would be ineffective.
51 A better approach would be to have a stop sign at Pine Street with no other signage.
52 . The problem with having too much signage is the opportunity for vandalism.
53 . Traveling in the reverse direction does not appear to be a problem. The problems essentially occur
5/ northbound.
5: _ . Acknowledged the configuration of the road gives the illusion Cypress Avenue continues right down Mr.
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Trouette's driveway.
Jeff Trouette:
• Is the property owner that has damage to his property as a result of persons speeding recklessly and /or
intoxicated and not being able to make the curve. People do not understand the street veers to the left and
they must turn on Cypress Avenue when proceeding northbound. People have the concept the street
continues straight, which is right though his property. The damages to his property have been extensive
and costly.
• There have been three reported accidents in the last 12 years to his property.
• There have been other accidents to neighboring properties.
• Has reported this problem to a former City Engineer in which no attempt has been made on the part of the
City to find a solution to the problem. It appears the City has no interest in doing anything to remedy the
situation.
• Supports the solution proposed by Member Whitaker of putting a stop sign at N. Pine Street and Cypress
Avenue. This will reduce accidents in this area except for that 1 %.
• People are not cognizant that a dip exists, particularly at night. While there is no warning sign advising that
a dip exists is not sure striping would be a workable solution.
• A hazard does exist and the City has an obligation to find a solution.
• It may be this case requires more analysis /study.
• Would like to see some resolution.
• City could consider providing for some curb and gutter along the side of the street to the corner.
Daphine MacNeil:
• Suggested painting a broad arrow curving over the dip. Is of the opinion an arrow sign would be helpful.
• Also likes the idea of having a stop sign at N. Pine Street and Cypress Avenue.
There was discussion about striping in the area.
Member Seanor:
• State regulations based on a national standard govern the application of stop signs subject to specific
conditions /certain criteria, such as number of accidents etc.
• The process of employing a stop sign requires an evaluation based on California- versed standards
because the California version modifies the national standard. Staff cannot recommend making a decision
regarding a new stop sign without an analysis such that all the conditions and required warrants have been
satisfactorily met.
• The City must be careful about putting in a stop sign that is warranted. If not warranted, people are not
going to respect it and roll through it.
• Stop signs are not to be used as a `speed control' mechanism. It is important stop signs are properly placed
at the right location.
• It may be a stop sign is not the right sign for this location.
• A DIP sign and Turn Sign with a 10 mph advisory speed plate would be appropriate.
Emily Turula: It is unlikely scrapes count as an accident. However, this may be a factor to consider that while there
are not a lot of accidents, there are a lot of scrapes that go unreported.
Chair Turner:
• Sees a condition where a valley gutter and turn are not obvious to people when driving down the street. To
this end, there may be some warrants in the list that would allow for an exception and /or qualifying factor
that allows for a stop sign in this case.
Member Jordan:
• Would like to have more information at the 'warrants' needed for a stop sign as to whether a stop sign is
feasible or warranted in the proposed location just because a DIP sign with 10 mph speed advisory and
arrow sign seems like a lot to consider in a short amount of time.
TEC October 9, 2012
Page 5 of 10
1 Member Seanor:
2_ • Will provide the committee with the documentation necessary for a stop sign.
• A new stop sign requires a process.
4 • Again, no decision can be made about a stop sign at this meeting.
6 Chair Turner:
7 . The agenda for this item states a 'discussion and possible action.'
8 • Does not support having another meeting about this matter.
9
10 Member Kageyama:
11 Has a concern about traffic coming eastbound on Cypress Avenue and continuing thru Pine Street into Oak
12 Street because people traveling eastbound traffic on Cypress Avenue do not have to stop and travel at a
13 higher rate of speed. There is the possibility that people traveling eastbound on Cypress Avenue could
14 collide with a car proceeding north from the stop sign at N. Pine Street and Cypress Avenue. It is like
15 having a blind curve in this location.
16 It is possible for a driver to be heading east on Cypress Avenue to N. Oak Street at the same time a car is
17 stopped at N. Pine Street thinking it is clear to proceed without seeing the car coming eastbound on
18 Cypress Avenue unless there is a three -way stop sign. There could be a sight distance issue at this
19 location.
20
21 Member Whitaker:
22 Is of the opinion having a stop sign at N. Pine and Cypress Avenue would not create a hazardous situation
23 for traffic eastbound on Cypress Avenue.
24
25 Recess: 3:45 p.m.
26 Reconvene: 4:07 p.m.
27
28 Member Seanor:
2' • Referred to an excerpt from the California supplement to the Manual of Uniform Traffic Control Devices
3b (MUTCD), 2012 Edition and noted 'Multi -way Stop Applications' as provided for in Section 213.07 of the
31 supplement applies to the traffic concern being discussed. A multi -way stop must be considered because
32 Cypress Avenue already has a sign.
33 • The process for a stop sign involves an analysis as provided for in subsection 26.07 of the supplement.
34 • The TEC will have the opportunity to review the analysis.
35 • Suggests an analysis be conducted for review by the TEC in November.
36
37 Chair Turner: Quickly looking at the conditions warranting a stop sign, this is a low volume intersection with a high
38 volume of concern.
39
40 Member Baxter:
41 . Subsection 26.06, item B, Stop Sign Applications indicates 'a restricted view exists that requires road users
42 to stop in order to adequately observe conflicting traffic on the through street or highway and /or ........
43 • Understands the view is an issue in this regard.
44
45 Member Seanor:
46 • Clarified the intent with regard to item B references the view when a person has problems seeing to make a
47 turn left or right.
48 • Staff is not prepared to make a recommendation about the traffic concern on N. Pine Street and Cypress
49 Avenue.
50
51 Member Taylor:
52 While there may be restrictions as to how the traffic concerns can be regulated, it may be that putting in
53 grooved pavement back far enough on N. Pine Street before the dip like those used on Highway 20 and 53
54 would be helpful.
5' i
TEC October 9, 2012
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Member Whitaker: The problem with this approach is the noise impacts to the neighborhood.
Member Taylor:
• In talking with Mr. Troulette the way his driveway is configured it may be a good idea `to paint a barrier' on
the inside of the corresponding corner of the street that is highly visible and painted at an angle leaving the
driveway open to make it apparent there is a driveway as opposed to a street.
• Has seen areas in Ukiah where painted barriers have made a difference.
• If a 10 mph advisory sign is placed through the dip according to the California Vehicle Code there is
nothing the UPD can do as far as enforcement because it is advisory only. What can be done in this regard
is the incident would have to be justified as reckless driving, exhibition or the like, which would have to be
witnessed. The rumble strips may be noisy, but they do slow people down. If the stop sign could not be
implemented, rumble strips would certainly warn people that a hazard is coming up and somehow flag the
dip with signage to let people know it is there. Is sure many people do not know the dip is in the road.
It was noted a rumble strip would require compliance with some criteria. The neighborhood would have to be
notified.
Member Taylor:
• The dip in the road essentially acts as a speed control mechanism. It is much like the speed bumps and /or
roundabouts that have been implemented in and around the City.
22 Staff noted rubber speed bumps do make noise for the neighborhood.
23
24 Chair Turner: Speed bumps do have neighbor notification implications and neighborhoods do have opinions about
25 their effectiveness and use.
26
27 Steve Scalmanini:
28 • Acknowledged there are traffic problems in the area.
2' . Asked about how a painted barrier would work.
3L
31 Member Taylor:
32 As per the California Vehicle Code section, no one can drive across a painted barrier if it is to be
33 enforceable not even for a driveway. The driveway area would have to be left open. Ukiah no longer has
34 painted barriers. They are essentially painted islands. For an inside corner has no idea about what the
35 engineering requirements would be painted barrier.
36
37 Member Kageyama:
38 • Is not supportive of a stop sign at least at this time.
39 • The biggest issue is drivers not seeing the turn.
40 • As an alternative to the W1 -1 (Turn Sign), provide for a W1 -6 sign or horizontal arrow that would be placed
41 right in the line of the vehicle's headlights at the end N. Pine Street for northbound traffic pointing left.
42 Same scenario for eastbound traffic with the arrow pointing right. This would alert the driver he /she must
43 make the turn.
44
45 Member Seanor:
46 • The aforementioned sign is highly visible and would work on many applications, but in the location of N.
47 Pine Street and Cypress Avenue this type of sign would not work because Mr. Trouette's driveway is right
48 in the alignment area where the sign would have to be placed for northbound traffic.
49
50 Member Baxter: Recommends also evaluating painting the curb with diagonals and use yellow
51 darts /arrows /reflectors on the asphalt to call out the attention of drivers that a hazard would occur around the bend.
52
53 There was discussion about potentially eliminating the street parking that currently exists in the area in order to
54 provide for some mitigation measures.
9
5b M/S Baxter/Whitaker to defer further discussion regarding agenda item 5a so staff can review the warrants and
TEC October 9, 2012
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1 conditions for a stop sign as well as the alternative measures expressed here today to include review of all other
2 planning documents as part of the original staff report for this matter.
Discussion: Members expressed concern whether or not the analysis can be completed by November.
4
5 Motion carried by an all AYE voice vote of the members present. (8 -0).
6
7 Chair Turner: Recommended those persons interested in having TEC meetings later in the day to contact City
8 Engineer Tim Eriksen.
9
10 5b. Discussion and Possible Action Regarding crosswalk request — Observatory Avenue
11
12 Member Taylor spoke to agenda item b and is in favor of a crosswalk at the proposed location of Observation
13 Avenue at Marwen Drive.
14
15 Chair Turner advised Observatory Avenue originates at S. State Street.
16
17 Member Seanor:
18 • Referred to his Memorandum for this agenda item dated October 4, 2012.
19 • Martin Bradley is requesting a crosswalk be placed on Observatory Avenue at Marwen Drive to assist
20 students and other pedestrians walking to and from the Community Transition Program on Observatory
21 Avenue.
22 • At some point Observatory Park will be more developed and open to the public where the park could be
23 access though the proposed crosswalk.
24 • Observatory Street operates east/west. Marwen Drive ends at a T- intersection with Observatory Avenue
25 opposite the Community Transition Program.
26 • There are no ADA curb ramps at the intersection of Marwen Drive with Observatory Avenue.
27 . The proposed crosswalk would be considered mid -block since there is not a through cross street
28 intersection at the requested location.
2' . Mid -block crosswalks are not generally preferred since drivers do not expect crosswalks at locations other
3'U than intersections.
31 • Crosswalks can give pedestrians a false sense of security that they are protected from traffic.
32 • The proposed crosswalk would provide the necessary channelization to make certain all pedestrians cross
33 at the specified location.
34 . Should a crosswalk be implemented, trained crossing guards could be utilized to provide additional safety.
35 • Requests the committee review and consider staff's recommendation provided for in his memorandum.
36
37 Martin Bradley:
38 • Is representing the school's request for a possible crosswalk.
39 • A crossing guard would not likely be feasible or necessary. The students attending the program 18 to 21
40 years old.
41 . Currently, students get off the bus on Washington Avenue and walk west to Observatory Avenue. One of
42 the problems is there are no sidewalks in some portions of the street.
43 • The students use MTA for transportation and the bus does not have a route where it can drop students in
44 front of the school. This would be a good solution in terms of a safety measure.
45 • Is of the opinion a crosswalk is necessary in the location proposed as a safety precautionary measure.
46 • People cross the street because there is no easy /accessible exit to Dora Street. Accordingly, there is
47 parking in front of the school such that people are walking in the street.
48 • Is of the opinion people would use the crosswalk unless they want to take a short cut. if a crosswalk exists,
49 it is likely people would use it as a safety precaution.
50 • Has observed it is difficult for the students to safely cross the street.
51 • Pedestrian traffic will increase in the area when Observatory Park is open to the public, particularly on the
52 Observatory Avenue side. People and /or students will no longer have to go around the block. This is a
53 factor in the future.
5' ) • Observatory Avenue has a natural flow of traffic because it is located in a neighborhood where people are
5., } coming and going. There may be peak times during the day as people drive on Observatory Avenue
TEC October 9, 2012
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coming from Helen Avenue.
Member Seanor:
4 • At first glance in his initial review of the project, the proposed crosswalk did not meet the requirements for a
5 school crosswalk.'
7 Committee comments:
8 • It may be a good idea in terms of looking at a potential crosswalk to look at the definition of a 'school' since
9 the students that attend the transition program are essentially adults. The educational facility is not a K -12
10 school, but rather a secondary school as it relates to the appropriate color of the paint for the crosswalk.
11 • The color of the crosswalk was not discussed in staff's report.
12 . The location of transition educational program is not within a quarter of a mile of Nokomis Elementary
13 School in terms of the appropriate color for the crosswalk, Le, white or yellow.
14 • Discussion about whether it is problematic to put a new painted crosswalk where there is no curb cut and
15 this is of concern to the Committee.
16 • The sidewalks in the area are not ADA compliant.
17 • There is a driveway opening on north side of site that could function as a curb cut. Accordingly, it was
18 determined the driveway does not line up with the end of one of the sidewalks. There is, however, a
19 driveway on the north side of the curb return which closely lines up and could function as a curb return.
20 There is no such infrastructure on the south side.
21 • The sidewalks in the area are narrow having a 'tight radius.'
22 . Discussion whether the crosswalks are required to be diagonal or 90 degrees to the street. The driveway to
23 the facility could be modified in some way so it is not a driveway and made into a curb cut so that it lines up
24 with the crosswalk.
25 • Further discussion about feasibility from a safety perspective for a mid -block crosswalk that would not
26 connect to any sidewalk or to a sidewalk that is not ADA compliant. This situation could eventually change
27 in the future when Observatory Park is no longer a passive park and more open to the public where a
28 crosswalk would actually be beneficial in this location. There is no sidewalk on the south side of the street.
2�� ) • Discussion about other streets in the vicinity of the project that do not have sidewalks.
3\0 • Just because a crosswalk gets installed does not mean it will be used.
31 • Expressed concern that 1) people do not change their habits and 2) drivers do not necessarily pay attention
32 to crosswalks and questioned whether the proposed sidewalk is really a safe approach to take.
33 • Does not necessarily agree that the crosswalk would be used.
34 . Discussion where it would be safe to cross the street if no crosswalk was installed.
35 • Crosswalks typically occur at intersection not in the middle of a block. Drivers do not anticipate traffic
36 issues mid - block, but rather at intersections.
37 . It was noted many people use Marwen Drive as it is a straight shot to Helen Avenue in terms of traffic
38 behavior.
39 • Discussion about whether any of the sidewalks on Marwen Drive line up with a sidewalk across the street
40 on Observatory Avenue. It was determined there is a curb and planter strip.
41 • People take short cuts to access different streets in the area.
42 • The crosswalk may be okay in the proposed location even though it is not at a regular T- intersection. Such
43 a crosswalk would eventually serve Observatory Park when it is developed and it would be located
44 approximately mid -way between Dora Street and Helen Avenue for convenience purposes.
45 • The concern with having a mid -block crosswalk is the need to for the crosswalk to line up with the
46 sidewalks on either side of the street and /or the concern of placing a crosswalk in a spot where there is no
47 pedestrian ramp /curb cuts.
48 • It may be the City will adopt such sidewalk improvements into its sidewalk improvement plan as a long term
49 solution.
50 • It was noted the City has a list of future curb ramps but they are for existing crosswalks.
51 • It would be beneficial to look at funding sources for sidewalk improvements such that a crosswalk could
52 effectively serve the public safely. There may be funding available related to Observatory Park where a
53 pedestrian ramp /curb cut can be part of the Park development plan.
5 • Questioned whether drivers would be expecting a crosswalk mid -block on Observatory and is more of
5 safety hazard than a precautionary measure.
TEC October 9, 2012
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1 It may be during peak times when school is over is when traffic and pedestrian traffic escalate in the area.
_ Not having connecting sidewalks on either side of the crosswalk is problematic.
• Drivers would probably like to have some warning that a crosswalk exists mid - block.
4
5 Member Jordan:
6 • Asked if Mr. Bradley's would be open to waiting and possibly pursuing a solution to pedestrian traffic issues
7 in connection with the full development of Observatory Park.
8 . What is the prospect of being able to install a crosswalk with signage? Is it feasible to put a newly painted
9 crosswalk where there is no curb cut?
10
11 Member Seanor:
12 • The signage would have to be maintained by City crews.
13 • A driveway exists but it does not line up correctly for a potential crosswalk.
14
15 Member Baxter:
16 If someone wanted to use the crosswalk and if the driveway nearby was used to access the crosswalk how
17 far would this be to the crosswalk? What about alternative solutions?
18
19 Committee comments:
20 • Would not want to put a crosswalk leading into someone's driveway.
21 • Persons would have to travel approximately 20 feet from the driveway to the crosswalk since there are no
22 ADA accessible sidewalks for the crosswalk.
23 . What is essentially occurring is providing for a crosswalk but at the same time sending people out into the
24 street to use the crosswalk.
25 • Providing for a new crosswalk would be creating a new condition where knowingly people would be walking
26 in the street to access the crosswalk. There is no designated pathway to the crosswalk. Is this what we
27 want to happen?
2 P . It was noted people cross where they want to cross now.
2, . Discussion about alternative options that would involve eliminating parking on the street and red curbing.
30 • The most effective approach would be to install a crosswalk when the sidewalk improvements are done.
31 • Asked staff to provide more information about the feasibility of providing a crosswalk on Observatory
32 Avenue at Marwen Drive.
33
34 M/S Seanor /Jordan to defer action on this item and requested more information from staff about the feasibility of a
35 crosswalk on Observation Avenue at Marwen Drive. Motion carried by an all AYE voice vote of the members
36 present.
37
38 6. COMMITTEE MEMBER REPORTS
39 Member Seanor reported on street improvements in progress in the City particularly at the intersection of S. State
40 Street and E. Gobbi Street and from E. Gobbi Street to S. Main Street.
41
42 7. MISCELLANEOUS ITEMS
43 Member Baxter referred to the intersection of E. Gobbi Street and Babcock Lane and noted the owner of the
44 house on the corner of Oak Manor Drive took matter into his own hands by landscaping his yard with very large
45 rocks to prevent reckless drivers from hitting his house.
46
47 8. ADJOURNMENT
48 Thefje being no further business, the meeting adjourned at 5:12 p.m.
49
50
51 Cathy Illawadly, Reco ing Secretary
52
TEC October 9, 2012
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